From Rocket City to the Artemis Generation: Lane Polak on Making NASA's Story Matter

Welcome, today I am joined by Lane Pollack, who is the strategic communication professional
for NASA's SLS program and the author of the Children's Series, I am Artemis produced
by NASA.
Welcome, Lane.
Hi.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah.
Great to have you.
So you've kind of described to me in the past that you have an unconventional pathway
to NASA, and particularly as their technical writer, can you share for our listeners
about your journey and what brought you to NASA and what inspired you to write these children's
books?
Sure, absolutely.
So I'm from a city in Alabama, Huntsville, Alabama, where Redstone Arsenal is, Huntsville's
known as the Rocket City.
It's a very space-centric town.
Most of my friends growing up their parents were engineers, most children, they grew up in
households right there, they probably grew up to be engineers.
That was not my background.
I was not very interested in rockets or space or any of that other stuff.
I went to a school, Challenger Elementary School, was where I went to grade school.
And then I went to Brissam High School.
So again, just very space-centric.
And when I was growing up, I just didn't really have a connection to any of those things.
And I was into writing.
I was into drawing.
I have a neurodivergent on ADHD.
So I thrive in creative processes and building things.
And so that was kind of my journey is, I knew that I wanted to be a writer from a very
young age.
I got into technical writing for about 13 or 14 years.
And somewhere along the way, I just applied for a position for NASA, for a technical
writer, and within the first couple of weeks of being in this department, I realized that
it was much different than technical writing.
There was some technical writing, I was writing papers and documentation for things that
we needed for this program.
But in a Stratcom department, it's a lot like marketing without selling anything like
we're advocating for the program.
We're chartered to interact with education and stakeholders and congressional stakeholders
and kind of show the value of our program and why it is that we are, like what we're
doing with your money and why we're going back to the moon with these missions.
And so very early on, I just kind of looked at our catalog of things that we had
going on and we were calling a younger generation.
We were calling them the Artemis generation.
So we're going to the moon so that this younger generation can go further.
They can go beyond, right?
And I just didn't see a whole lot of stuff for a young generation.
I have a seven year old in the four year old and I was just looking for things for them.
And we kind of had like some children's books, but they were, they were books with
beautiful pictures and just talking points that were just too, too big to understand
for this younger generation.
And I had published some children's stuff before and I was working on my own stuff.
And just for fun, I just was like, I'm going to write a story for this first part of
the program, which is this rocket, the SLS and I'm going to write this and I'm just going
to pitch it to my boss because we have these weekly pitch meetings and I pitched it and
she was like, this is great.
Where do we go from here?
So that's kind of, I know that was a lot, but that's kind of early life leading into NASA
and getting the forefront with these bugs.
I love that NASA supported both your technical writing and your creativity when you went to
your team and said, I want to create these children's books.
Yes, it was unexpected.
I had always wanted to be in a position where I wrote more creatively because technical writing
is very process driven.
There's a lot of standard operating procedures.
You're writing a lot of installation step-by-step kind of stuff and because the way how my brain
works, I tend to find a process or a thing in a professional environment that is a form of
creativity and so I was thriving creatively, but then I came here and it just kind of opened
up a completely different chapter of creativity for me that was really fun and kind of what I was
expecting out of like a department like this.
I mean, I think, you know, we've talked about this before, certainly I've shared on the show
about this before that a lot of people that aren't working with children's literature don't
quite understand how complex it is.
I think that there's a common notion out there that, oh, anybody can write a children's book,
you know, it's similar than writing a novel, but that's not the case at all on what you've been
able to do through these three books is take something very complex, but make it understandable to
children. They're also all in gum below. They're also very whimsical in nature. They're rhyming
in style, which is great for young children. So can you share a little bit about how story
telling can make such a complex topic like space exploration more accessible for children and
and their parents really are open up a conversation at home?
Yeah, I'll go back just a little bit to like when I was a kid is, um, I guess space wasn't relatable
to me when I was little, um, which is so interesting because now, um, if you guys are
keeping up with like the, the mission, like the Artemis missions with, with Artemis too,
like this crew that's going back, uh, to just went back to space and how we're going to continue
to go back to the moon with more people, um, it is very relatable. Like those people made that mission
very special and it connected an entire planet of people, um, that followed it and that was kind
of writing children's books like that, um, you know, I was writing a story that I felt like
would connect with children, but I was also writing a story that I was trying to tell myself, you know,
there's a lot of different pieces to NASA's very big, right? And this, like SLS, like the
space launch system rocket, it's just one thing. It's just one program in like a sea of programs
with NASA, right? And it's very difficult and complex and, um, you know, I go out and I do
outreach and I talk to people about this stuff all the time. And early on, I was like, I need
something that I need a tool, I need a thing that like helps me remember like the major parts of
this rocket and what it does and how it works. And um, early on, like that's kind of what I was
doing with this book because I was like, yeah, I want to teach children the stuff, but I need to
teach myself this stuff first, right? And the best way to do that is you connect it to something
that's relatable to yourself. And so, um, I went through and I just kind of dissected it into
different pieces. I was like, what's the major stuff? Like, that we need to talk about, um, and then
it just kind of group because they allowed, like, my team allowed it to grow. They were like,
you did the rocket, now do another program. Like, do Orion, which is, um, it's the spacecraft
that the astronauts are in. And then that went well. And they're like, okay, now go do, um,
this other program that not many people know about, it's called EGS, like the exploration
ground systems. And that's the, that's the people that it's a team. It's a team of people that
assemble the rocket. They watch the rocket and then they're the ones that recover it. And so,
every time that I would write these books, like, I'm learning more. And so, I'm trying to
relate it to this younger audience, so that as I'm learning their, I guess is kind of where I was going
with that. Yeah. And it's, it goes back to what you were sharing before you didn't have. I mean,
you saw engineering and science growing up, but you maybe didn't see that as a career for you.
How do you think that these types of children's books help shape their view of science,
technology, engineering, um, and their future in it? I'm hoping that, you know, I'm hoping that
it makes things relatable because I think at that early of an age, like a story is what creates an
initial score of inspiration, right? And so I'm hoping that that, um, you know, something that
is a NASA's charter and their values is, is, is to inspire the next generation, right?
So I'm hoping that these are going to be used as a tool that will inspire, um, but also, you know,
I love telling people, I was just having a conversation just a few minutes ago with, um,
what the chief engineer of this program. And I was telling him, I said, I love going to these places,
I love reading these stories. I love being able to sit here and and tell them how they fit into this,
because there's probably kids that want to be engineers or they want to be at at least they want to be
astronauts, right? But I bet a lot of them don't know that they can write stories. And I bet a lot of
them don't know that they can draw pictures. Or, um, you know, we build like people build rockets,
like engineers design them, but people are what build rockets. And we need people, like we need
skill technicians to build rockets. And I think that right now, not a lot of people consider
skilled technicians as, uh, as a value, uh, career choice, right? And so it's cool to go into a
school and say, you know, whatever the age difference can say, hey, if you don't want to go to college,
but you will like, like, you like to build stuff. And you like to do things with your hands, like,
do you like, like, built in Legos, like, do you like, um, building, like things with robotics,
or whatever, I'm like, you can literally go to a tech school, learn how to weld and do all these
things. And then you can take this down here to, um, can be a space center and you can be a person who
assembles these rockets. Like, that is a whole stream, right? Like, there's just so many career
opportunities and things at NASA that weren't even on my radar. And I think that's why I also just
didn't relate to it. I was like, oh, well, I'm not good at math. And I don't want to go to space.
Like, those, so those, so because of those two things, like, I'm just, I'm not going to pursue any,
any sort of field, uh, in NASA. And that just couldn't be further than the truth. Like, it's just
such a large agency. And there's something for everybody. It's inclusive, you know? Yeah, I love that.
I mean, I've shared with you before my daughter wants to be an astronaut and a princess, a princess,
you know, astronaut. Um, so like, so in my mind, it's like, every child wants to be an astronaut.
It's kind of like, everybody wants to play the main character in the play, you know, but that's just,
that's just not always true. There are many children out there that want to be involved in space
exponent exploration, but they don't want to be on the rocket ship. So something like helping with
the technical pieces that you're describing or helping with the writing components. These are always
that, um, you can participate in space exploration without being on the ship yourself. Absolutely.
We, I remember like, there was one time that we were in Salt Lake City, Utah for a, um,
like a conference. It was like a Comic-Con because also like that was something that NASA does,
is like they, um, programs can go and sign up for these conferences and relate what we're doing to
the public and, um, and show them the value that it has. And so I remember being there
and it got, our booth got so much traffic and there was this one younger lady that was there
that was a college student and she just was like, I'm so glad you guys are here. I can't believe
you guys are here like, um, I'm such a massive fan. I love space. I love all the things that you guys
produce, um, you know, y'all are so great, y'all are so smart, um, but you know, like, uh, I'm just
a fan. Like, I don't, I don't belong here. Like, I, there's no, there's no room for me in your sandbox.
And I just remember asking her, I said, well, what, you're in college, like, what are you going
to school for? And she's like, I'm going to school for cinematography. And I was like, oh, that's
awesome. I sit next to two guys that do that. Like, that's their job. Is they, they come to work
every day with their camera equipment. And they go, and they take pictures of, like, progress
pictures of what's happening with this rocket. Like, they set up GoPro cameras. Um, you know,
when we launched, like, they had so many different, um, like, chances to like take pictures of the
rocket as close as they were able to take pictures. They video tape launched. And then they take it
and they, they edit all of it together. And in a sense, like, they're telling a part of the story.
Like, there's a visual story that they're giving us. So it's just really cool, you know, and that's
I love a lot of my position here. And I love that I've gotten to make my own things. But it's
really cool to show other people that there's probably a place here for them that, that there's
something that they can pursue. Yeah, I love that. And I love the setting it up for the future,
the way you described it. Why do we, why are we going to the moon now? Because we want to inspire
the next generation that they can go further. It's absolutely important mission. Um, so you've
shared about your own creativity. Do you mind talking a little bit about how curiosity and creativity
can be nurtured for children and how it can be grown over time, especially in those middle school
years when engagement often seems to drop? Yeah, absolutely. Um, what do you think for just a moment?
That's such a great question. Um, so with our own two boys, um, you know, they were kind of my
test audience for a lot of the things that I was creating. Not just the stories, but I like I had
created like activities and, um, puzzles and hands-on STEM activities and things that
been resources that they, that they can now use and play with. Um, and they were really helpful
with what worked out because I would watch and pay attention to how they were interacting with it.
And if they wanted to do it or if they were just doing it because dad asked them to do it.
And so, um, I think that so much of right now with a younger audience is it's about
being present with them and it's about it's about showing them how to be creative. And then it's
also about like sitting back and just letting them do it, right? Um, I think that when I first started
working here that I would go to some of these places and, uh, I was surprised that we didn't have
as much hands-on like stuff, right, for kids to play with, um, to touch to feel to see, um, or just to
build, right? And, uh, I have to remember being at this one, uh, STEM event at a, uh,
a kind of middle school. And it was like our table and we had like some work sheets and stickers and hands
out, handouts and then, uh, like a model, the SLS and across the hall was a guy with a long table
and he was a geologist and he just had like a whole table full of different types of rocks
in crystals. And I just remember seeing so many people go to his table and like not come to our
table. And I was like, let's go on over there and I was like, oh my gosh, he has stuff for them to
look and see. That's right. So, um, it's so important to have stuff like that and it's so important to,
you know, let them have their own experience with whatever it is that's in front. And I think that
when you're there with them, facilitating it, um, just be present and be ready to answer questions
and kind of continue to stir curiosity. Um, when I go and I, I read these books like, uh, I'm
impressed by how creative the questions are that I'm getting, um, from like, first and second grade.
And I never kind of, I'm never like, oh, I can answer that question unless it's like something
that's like way outside of my wheelhouse, like we get a lot of questions like, what do black holes do
and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,
I don't know what black holes do because like I'm, you know, in space exploration and propulsion,
but I can answer you guys, I can tell you guys all about the moon and it's rocket and what this
place does, um, but the questions that I get are so, there's no thought provoking even for me that
like most of the time it's there's my own, like curiosity and creativity. And I end up, sometimes
I end up like writing their questions down and like making another list of questions for myself
to ask the next crop of kids because, again, like, they're kind of part of the story.
And there's things that they want to learn about and I want to be able to kind of help
facilitate that. So, I kind of could have driven on like your original question like,
yeah, I think it's just being present and being encouraging it and creativity and curiosity
can come in several different forms, right? And it's just kind of being there to walk
parallel with with the younger generation or beside them and kind of help them, you know,
have the confidence to, to know more, you know, like most of the time I'm just like,
you can ask me any question and don't be embarrassed and like, how can I make you feel,
how can I am bold and you with with power to do that, right? So,
I hope that answered your question. Yeah, I think there's something so powerful to
in what you were just describing of a child asked you a question and you say, I don't know,
but here's how I'm going to find out. It's kind of, it models for them that as adults, we don't
have all the answers, but we're willing to look for them and we have tools to help us. I think that's
a great way to continue to inspire curiosity is just ask as many questions as you can.
I think that I agree and I was going to say, I think that like, you know,
an adult vulnerability is a strength. It can be a strength than not a weakness. I think that
if you can be vulnerable and show, you know, if you're transparent that you don't know
something or you're not great at something, but you're learning, I think, at least to me,
and at least like when I talk to my own children, like, it creates a sense of trust with an older
person and respect. And so, you know, at least like with my kids, like, they feel more encouraged
knowing that I'm not perfect and I don't have it all together. Because they're not putting
me on this pedestal that I have, they have to do a thing to be like me. They know that they can
do it with me, like beside me. And if I don't know how to do it, then we figure it out together.
And so many times, like, if I get a question that that I don't know, like,
one time, like, this little boy asked me, he goes, how far away is Jupiter? And I was like,
I don't know. That's a great question. I'm like, are you asking because, like, you want to know,
like, how long it's going to take to get there if we want to go there next? And he's like, yeah,
and I was like, well, and I told him what I did know, I was like, this is how far it is from, like,
the Earth to the moon is how far it is from, like, the moon to Mars. Now, let me just look it up on
my phone. I was like, Jupiter's this. I'm like, so it would be this, right? You know, so I gave
him what I could. And then I just encouraged him. I was like, I think another boy actually in there.
Yeah, that's right. There was another boy in that class that was like, oh, I think it's this.
And he, I think he was just, like, slightly off. And I was like, that was really close. I'm like,
and so I kind of was like, hey, you should talk to this boy more often. He might be able to answer
questions about this stuff. So I'm creating a sense of community amongst his peers, right? So
it's actually a really cool experience to when um, children know the answers and you, you don't,
I mean, talk about them being experts in their own, um, you know, don't in their own world.
So to say, when I was a teacher at the inspired teaching demonstration school, we had a principle
that was student as expert. And I actually had a parent challenge me on that one time and say,
I don't like you calling um kids experts because in my family, you know, only like doctors and
PhDs are our experts and that's kind of what we're teaching our children. And I was like, yeah,
I can see that's valid, but also I think it's experts within their own world, right,
within their, their own understanding. So it's kind of like you pairing those students together,
one student has an interest in space and one student, yeah, he's not quote unquote an expert in
space, but he's very knowledgeable of space. Maybe he's read some books on space and can answer
that student's question. So in that kind of relationship, he's the space, he's the space expert of
their friendship. Right. Yes, absolutely. Um, you know, and I think that like with my own children,
like I noticed that my son has friends that are, they're really, really smart with their
coursework and stuff. And he's doing just fine. But his level of like emotional maturity is
it's very unique for seven year old. Like he's able to kind of like verbalize a lot of
stuff that like I'm noticing that like some of his friends and peers like they're, they're just not
there yet, right? And so I think that it is interesting to see just a child's development in growth
and as they age into whatever it is that they're going to do next. Like, um, I think those skills
are going to factor into it somehow. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's part of that community building
too that you were describing is acknowledging that we all have strengths and they're different than
each other. And I mean, going back to the example of what does it take to create a space mission?
Is that and being an expert in your own world, it takes many experts to create a space mission.
And it's not and it's a community of experts that are each working kind of in their domain and not
everyone's the astronaut. But if we were all astronauts, then we wouldn't actually go to space,
because it takes a whole community of people to make that. So many people. I think that something
that's really cool about, um, the pilot for this last mission for our own was to use a
name and Victor Glover. And I remember being at an event with him and he
doesn't like, he doesn't like his picture being taken, like he doesn't like his having his picture
up around like the building. I think he said something like, uh, because they're large pictures that
are pictures and high definition. I mean, I think he said like, no one should be able to see
their pores and hide it. But he said, but I will tell you this. He's like, if, if there were,
if there was a picture around here, if I were to ask a request for like a portrait,
he's like, I would love for it to be like one of those pictures that's like a mosaic where it's
like a bunch and like a little image. Yeah, that's his image, but all those little images are the
people that contribute to Artemis, right? Um, and he's right. Like it's that's it's a beautiful image,
because it's just unbelievable to me how large this, this thing is and how large space
exploration is and the people that are involved, all the way down to like the little widgets,
but then also like all the way into like my department where it's people that are just
we're we're connecting, we're the connective tissue, we're telling the story, um,
these astronauts like they have nutritionists. Like there's just so many different things that are
involved to do what we just did again. And uh, yeah, it's just, you know, it's it's overwhelming
and it's very cool. And that's again, that's why I love telling people about it because I'm
like there's a place in there. Like you're one of those pictures and they're if you want to be
you know that's that's super cool. Well, Lane, I have one final question and it may be actually
more challenging than where new black holes come from. Um, this is great. Anyone who ever
comes on the show answers this question and everyone says how challenging it is. So it is what is
reading what does reading inspire for you? Well, um, yeah, um, reading inspires me to connect
with people, uh, reading stories inspires me to help people find their story and it makes me feel
vulnerable to share mine. Um, and I think that something that is really
great and unique that I've gotten to experience like just a little bit of within like these
last couple of years was establishing these stories and being a storyteller. Um, is,
is what it means and I've met so many different authors that had, it just feels like all of our
stories are somewhat kind of interconnected like a spider web. Um, we're all kind of the same.
We're all kind of different. We're all challenging ourselves to do this thing so that we can
read each other's stuff and and and get these things out there that are important to us. But like,
I think that something that was really interesting for me personally was, um, why am I reading,
why am I trying to write things that I that I want to be read and where does it
matter where they go, right? Because I have all these other stories that are personal that I want
to eventually get out here. And so I have like, uh, oh, and for a run, like over a month ago,
uh, so I've been like an existential crisis about like what it means to be a writer and to create
and, uh, where certain things were going to get picked up and how they were going to be seen.
And I just remember getting to the end of this rope and the end of this run and just standing
there for a second and being like, what, what do you trying to do? Like what, what, what do you want
to tell? Like why do you want to tell stories? And why is it so important for this story to be told
in this way and be seen and be read in this way? And I really have a, I really have a good answer
for myself, um, and I started thinking about it and I asked the question of what's my agenda.
And my agenda is I just want to, uh, I want, I want to connect with people and I want those people
to be seen and I want them to just know how awesome they are. And I, I'm already doing that.
Like, that's already happening, right? You know, so, um, I get to do that at least once or twice.
So we, by reading these stories to children and, um, and getting to share these types of things
with you. So reading to me is it's, it's, it's a way to connect with with people and in community,
yeah. Amazing. And if listeners, if you haven't picked up on this lane, does do school visits
and it wasn't, it wasn't, it wasn't obvious from, um, sharing questions students, um,
asks. So if you're interested in getting in contact with him, I'll put that in the show notes
as well. And, and you can have lane come to your school and present to your students. But
thank you so much, Lane. I, I want to repeat those questions because I think for anybody who's
and aspiring writer out there, they're important. I might be paraphrasing them a little bit.
But it's, why am I telling this story? Why is it important that I'm telling this story in this
way? So the medium. And where do I want this to go? Yes. I love it. Thank you, Lane. And if anything
resonated with you listening to this episode, if you have a fellow space enthusiast out there,
please share it with them. Thanks.